As to flaccid length, there's definitely been a change since the start of cycling at 6 weeks. Unfortunately I didn't measure the flaccid length at 6 weeks, but over the past 7 months it has clearly, noticeably changed. My wife noticed and has commented several times that I'm definitely hanging longer flaccid, no ruler needed. And yes, I squeeze my dick to remove as much fluid as I can back to the reservoir and I don't do a one pump after deflation which might cause a small amount of inflation. I'm just hanging longer flaccid than I did months ago. She and I both agree that it's probably at least 1 inch more flaccid hang. Can't really explain it other than maybe scar tissue has been stretched, but in any case I'm good with it
Length question
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1sfman
- Posts: 121
- Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2025 9:12 am
- Location: Central Illinois
Re: Length question
Just a follow-up on my earlier post. I've gained very little erect length over the past 7 months. Six weeks post-op when I started cycling, I measured just a fraction under 6 inches. Pre-op using a VED with a hard vacuum, I measured 6 3/8 inches. Would I have had a natural erection of that length without ED? Don't know, but a VED will definitely stretch you out. I now measure 6 1/8 inches pumped 100%, so that appears to be some length improvement from the 6 weeks measurement. That may be some actual length expansion, or it could be that some lingering swelling over the pubic bone finally dissipated.
As to flaccid length, there's definitely been a change since the start of cycling at 6 weeks. Unfortunately I didn't measure the flaccid length at 6 weeks, but over the past 7 months it has clearly, noticeably changed. My wife noticed and has commented several times that I'm definitely hanging longer flaccid, no ruler needed. And yes, I squeeze my dick to remove as much fluid as I can back to the reservoir and I don't do a one pump after deflation which might cause a small amount of inflation. I'm just hanging longer flaccid than I did months ago. She and I both agree that it's probably at least 1 inch more flaccid hang. Can't really explain it other than maybe scar tissue has been stretched, but in any case I'm good with it
.
As to flaccid length, there's definitely been a change since the start of cycling at 6 weeks. Unfortunately I didn't measure the flaccid length at 6 weeks, but over the past 7 months it has clearly, noticeably changed. My wife noticed and has commented several times that I'm definitely hanging longer flaccid, no ruler needed. And yes, I squeeze my dick to remove as much fluid as I can back to the reservoir and I don't do a one pump after deflation which might cause a small amount of inflation. I'm just hanging longer flaccid than I did months ago. She and I both agree that it's probably at least 1 inch more flaccid hang. Can't really explain it other than maybe scar tissue has been stretched, but in any case I'm good with it
75 YO (1951). Happily married since 1972 (A couple since 1968). ED since age 60. Viagra, then Cialis, Trimix/Quadmix and VED. AMS 700 CX, 21cm + 1cm RTE left side, MS pump & 100cc reservoir. Implanted using Infrapubic procedure Jan 21, 2026.
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whatevery
- Posts: 165
- Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2025 3:10 pm
Re: Length question
Fitzgerald 2012 wrote:Revision surgery was 3 weeks ago. Next follow up in 4 weeks to show me (hopefully) how to pump and deflate. I lost some flaccid length from all the procedures. My question is for after recovery, does it get longer when you pump it up when you start cycling? And have you had success in gaining length the longer you cycle? TIA.
Yes, LGX and AX are suppose to expand lengthwise but you do have to work on it. I spoke to countless LGX recipients (over 10), all of whom expanded length wise, compared to their pre-op. Both Boston Scientific and Rigicon claim it on their websites. Dr. Hakky mentions it in one of his videos, and would at times upsize Titan and CX but never LGX and AX for those particular reasons. In fact from what I read here even Titan could give you more length at times with aggressive cycling but very little.
LGX on the other hand can make it noticeable. Notice that those that say that length expanding implants is BS are not length expanding implants recipients themselves. You'd be hard pressed to find a single LGX recipient that supports what they say, although I actually came across one that only got to his pre-op length but he admittedly didn't cycle much. I'm still to come across AX recipient whose length expanded beyond his pre-op but with LGX there is little doubt that it's possible, in fact even likely.
There are other potential issues with LGX though. It can get bendy. You shouldn't implant LGX if you already have a bend because it would likely exacerbate it although for some women bendy dick could serve as an additional girth substitute. Implanters claim that there are rigidity problems but I only came across one LGX recipient that experienced that. It was the same guy whose LGX didn't elongate. Everybody else claim that they haven't had their dicks as hard since the times immemorial. Also, LGX is a so called skinny implant so your penile weight could negatively effect it. I suggest to think carefully before implanting it if your current penile length is more than 6" (16.5cm). Also, LGX is more limited in girth expansion than other implants.
65 yrs old.
ED since about 2000.
Just moved to Trimix from Edex few months ago.
Implant doctor shopping now but doing BPH first.
ED since about 2000.
Just moved to Trimix from Edex few months ago.
Implant doctor shopping now but doing BPH first.
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Texas Otter
- Posts: 37
- Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2025 4:58 pm
Re: Length question
I am an attorney and in law school approximately 45 years ago, we studied the case of Hawkins v. McGee. It underlies why doctors who perform elective surgeries do not like to promise results. Here is a summary:
Hawkins v. McGee, 84 N.H. 114, 146 A. 641 (1929), is a contract law case known to law students as the “Case of the Hairy Hand.” It is famous for its mention in the movie and novel “The Paper Chase” and is frequently taught in law school contracts courses.
The question before the court was how to measure damages in a medical malpractice case brought under a breach of contract theory. The court defined that measure to be “expectation damages”: the difference in value between the post-operative hand and the perfect hand promised by the physician.
Under Hawkins v. McGee, if a physician guarantees a perfect hand following an attempted skin graft operation but provides a poorly functioning hand that sprouts hair from the palm, the plaintiff is entitled to be awarded the difference in value between the hand promised and the hand provided, plus incidental damages. The plaintiff is not entitled to recover for pain and suffering or impairment.
Facts of Hawkins v. McGee
When he was 11 years old, George Hawkins burned his right hand on an electric wire after turning on a light in his home. Edward R. B. McGee, a Berlin, New Hampshire physician, approached Charles Hawkins, George’s father, about using a skin grafting procedure he hadn’t done before to repair George’s hand. Dr. McGee proposed taking skin from George’s chest and using it to replace the scar tissue on his hand. He guaranteed George a “one hundred percent good hand.” On George’s behalf, Charles agreed to the procedure.
Dr. McGee performed what turned out to be a painful surgery, and George had a longer recovery time than expected. Not only did Dr. McGee fail to fix the hand, but George also grew thick hair on his palm from the graft taken from his chest.
Trial Court
Hawkins sued Dr. McGee for negligence and breach of contract (assumpsit). The trial court dismissed the negligence claim but let the contract claim proceed to trial. Over the defendant’s objection, the trial court instructed the jury that if it found that the defendant breached his warranty, it could award damages for the plaintiff’s pain and suffering and for impairment.
The jury returned a verdict for the plaintiff and awarded $3,000. Finding the award excessive, the trial court ordered that the verdict be set aside unless the plaintiff agreed to reduce it to $500. The plaintiff refused. The trial court set aside the verdict, and the plaintiff appealed. On appeal, the defendant contested the finding of an enforceable contract.
Supreme Court of New Hampshire
Before the court were two central issues:
Did the defendant, by guaranteeing a “one hundred percent good hand,” made a legally enforceable promise to the plaintiff that, if accepted, create a contract?
If so, would the proper measure of damages for breach of that contract include pain and suffering and damage to the hand?
Enforceable Promise?
The defendant argued that no reasonable person would interpret his statement as an offer. Reasonable people recognize that surgeries come with risks and that the result of the operation, no matter the physician’s expressed conviction, is never certain. Poor outcomes are always a possibility. Defendant’s promise to give George a “one hundred percent good hand” was not an offer that, even if accepted, could form an enforceable contract.
The New Hampshire Supreme Court disagreed. The court pointed out that the question of how a reasonable person would construe a statement was one for the jury. It only became a question for the court if no reasonable person could construe it otherwise. The court pointed out that the evidence at trial showed that the defendant had actively solicited the plaintiff to perform the surgery despite having virtually no skin grafting experience. This evidence supported the jury’s conclusion that the defendant’s statement should be taken at face value.
Measure of Damages
Having found the existence of a valid contract, the court turned to the proper measure of damages for its breach. The trial court had instructed the jury to award damages for the plaintiff’s pain and suffering and for the harm done to George’s hand by the surgery; in other words, tort damages.
The New Hampshire Supreme Court held that this instruction was wrong. The court pointed out that under the law of contracts, damages are measured by the terms of the contract. The purpose of the law is to put a plaintiff in the position they would be if the defendant not breached the contract.
Expectation Damages
Although the case was novel, the court analogized it to one in which someone promised to make a machine that could do specific work. If that person failed to provide the promised machine, the aggrieved party could recover the difference in value between what they were promised and what they actually got (expectation damages) plus incidental damages that the parties knew, or should have known, might result from the breach.
The court decided that this measure of recovery should apply to George’s case. Reasoning that expectation damages — the difference in value between a perfect hand and the hand George got — would best fulfill the purpose of contract damages, the court concluded that the jury instruction was erroneous and remanded the case for a new trial.
Rule of Law
The proper measure of damages in a breach of contract case against a physician that fails to provide a guaranteed surgical result is the difference in value between what was provided and what was promised (expectation damages).
Afterword
After Hawkins v. McGee was decided, the parties reached a settlement of $1,400. Dr. McGee then filed a claim with United States Fidelity and Guaranty Co., his malpractice carrier. The carrier denied coverage on the ground that the claim against the policy wasn’t based on the doctor’s negligence but instead was based on a breach of contract.
Dr. McGee sued his carrier. At trial, the court entered a directed verdict on behalf o the carrier. Dr. McGee appealed. In McGee v. United States Fidelity and Guaranty Co., 53 F.2d 953 (1st Cir. 1931), the U.S. Court of Appeals for the First Circuit affirmed the judgment, ruling that the malpractice policy covered the doctor’s “malpractice, error, or mistake” — negligence — but not his breach of a contract.
Hawkins v. McGee, 84 N.H. 114, 146 A. 641 (1929), is a contract law case known to law students as the “Case of the Hairy Hand.” It is famous for its mention in the movie and novel “The Paper Chase” and is frequently taught in law school contracts courses.
The question before the court was how to measure damages in a medical malpractice case brought under a breach of contract theory. The court defined that measure to be “expectation damages”: the difference in value between the post-operative hand and the perfect hand promised by the physician.
Under Hawkins v. McGee, if a physician guarantees a perfect hand following an attempted skin graft operation but provides a poorly functioning hand that sprouts hair from the palm, the plaintiff is entitled to be awarded the difference in value between the hand promised and the hand provided, plus incidental damages. The plaintiff is not entitled to recover for pain and suffering or impairment.
Facts of Hawkins v. McGee
When he was 11 years old, George Hawkins burned his right hand on an electric wire after turning on a light in his home. Edward R. B. McGee, a Berlin, New Hampshire physician, approached Charles Hawkins, George’s father, about using a skin grafting procedure he hadn’t done before to repair George’s hand. Dr. McGee proposed taking skin from George’s chest and using it to replace the scar tissue on his hand. He guaranteed George a “one hundred percent good hand.” On George’s behalf, Charles agreed to the procedure.
Dr. McGee performed what turned out to be a painful surgery, and George had a longer recovery time than expected. Not only did Dr. McGee fail to fix the hand, but George also grew thick hair on his palm from the graft taken from his chest.
Trial Court
Hawkins sued Dr. McGee for negligence and breach of contract (assumpsit). The trial court dismissed the negligence claim but let the contract claim proceed to trial. Over the defendant’s objection, the trial court instructed the jury that if it found that the defendant breached his warranty, it could award damages for the plaintiff’s pain and suffering and for impairment.
The jury returned a verdict for the plaintiff and awarded $3,000. Finding the award excessive, the trial court ordered that the verdict be set aside unless the plaintiff agreed to reduce it to $500. The plaintiff refused. The trial court set aside the verdict, and the plaintiff appealed. On appeal, the defendant contested the finding of an enforceable contract.
Supreme Court of New Hampshire
Before the court were two central issues:
Did the defendant, by guaranteeing a “one hundred percent good hand,” made a legally enforceable promise to the plaintiff that, if accepted, create a contract?
If so, would the proper measure of damages for breach of that contract include pain and suffering and damage to the hand?
Enforceable Promise?
The defendant argued that no reasonable person would interpret his statement as an offer. Reasonable people recognize that surgeries come with risks and that the result of the operation, no matter the physician’s expressed conviction, is never certain. Poor outcomes are always a possibility. Defendant’s promise to give George a “one hundred percent good hand” was not an offer that, even if accepted, could form an enforceable contract.
The New Hampshire Supreme Court disagreed. The court pointed out that the question of how a reasonable person would construe a statement was one for the jury. It only became a question for the court if no reasonable person could construe it otherwise. The court pointed out that the evidence at trial showed that the defendant had actively solicited the plaintiff to perform the surgery despite having virtually no skin grafting experience. This evidence supported the jury’s conclusion that the defendant’s statement should be taken at face value.
Measure of Damages
Having found the existence of a valid contract, the court turned to the proper measure of damages for its breach. The trial court had instructed the jury to award damages for the plaintiff’s pain and suffering and for the harm done to George’s hand by the surgery; in other words, tort damages.
The New Hampshire Supreme Court held that this instruction was wrong. The court pointed out that under the law of contracts, damages are measured by the terms of the contract. The purpose of the law is to put a plaintiff in the position they would be if the defendant not breached the contract.
Expectation Damages
Although the case was novel, the court analogized it to one in which someone promised to make a machine that could do specific work. If that person failed to provide the promised machine, the aggrieved party could recover the difference in value between what they were promised and what they actually got (expectation damages) plus incidental damages that the parties knew, or should have known, might result from the breach.
The court decided that this measure of recovery should apply to George’s case. Reasoning that expectation damages — the difference in value between a perfect hand and the hand George got — would best fulfill the purpose of contract damages, the court concluded that the jury instruction was erroneous and remanded the case for a new trial.
Rule of Law
The proper measure of damages in a breach of contract case against a physician that fails to provide a guaranteed surgical result is the difference in value between what was provided and what was promised (expectation damages).
Afterword
After Hawkins v. McGee was decided, the parties reached a settlement of $1,400. Dr. McGee then filed a claim with United States Fidelity and Guaranty Co., his malpractice carrier. The carrier denied coverage on the ground that the claim against the policy wasn’t based on the doctor’s negligence but instead was based on a breach of contract.
Dr. McGee sued his carrier. At trial, the court entered a directed verdict on behalf o the carrier. Dr. McGee appealed. In McGee v. United States Fidelity and Guaranty Co., 53 F.2d 953 (1st Cir. 1931), the U.S. Court of Appeals for the First Circuit affirmed the judgment, ruling that the malpractice policy covered the doctor’s “malpractice, error, or mistake” — negligence — but not his breach of a contract.
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LetoMan
- Posts: 521
- Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2024 1:25 pm
Re: Length question
Lol. Was the point of posting a “hairy hand” case brief to say that doctors are not promising that implants expand lengthwise because they are scared of lawsuits?
Yet, those same doctors are more than happy to say that implants expand girth, without fear of lawsuits.
The difference is that one is true, and one is not. And the truth is what doctors are ultimately beholden to. They quaintly refer to it as “evidence-based medicine.”
At the end of the day, there is simply no evidence of implants expanding lengthwise. And that’s why the small number of vocal crackpots on here keep failing to cite any evidence, but instead engage in ad hominem attacks.
Yet, those same doctors are more than happy to say that implants expand girth, without fear of lawsuits.
The difference is that one is true, and one is not. And the truth is what doctors are ultimately beholden to. They quaintly refer to it as “evidence-based medicine.”
At the end of the day, there is simply no evidence of implants expanding lengthwise. And that’s why the small number of vocal crackpots on here keep failing to cite any evidence, but instead engage in ad hominem attacks.
Born 1974. Implanted 5/21/2024. AMS 700 CX 21cm, 3cm RTE. Penoscrotal. Venous leak my whole life. Pills helped, but hated the side effects; worked less as I aged. Skipped injections. Grateful to bionic brotherhood that helped me make this decision.
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Texas Otter
- Posts: 37
- Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2025 4:58 pm
Re: Length question
When Clavell suggested the Titan for my revision, he stated that cylinders are wider than CX's cylinders. I drew my own conclusions and went with the Titan
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whatevery
- Posts: 165
- Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2025 3:10 pm
Re: Length question
LetoMan wrote:At the end of the day, there is simply no evidence of implants expanding lengthwise. And that’s why the small number of vocal crackpots on here keep failing to cite any evidence, but instead engage in ad hominem attacks.
This is 100% false. You've been shown evidence more than once, including by LGX recipients, and you just refuse to accept it no matter what. No LGX recipient on this forum would back up what you say. Because most of them grew over their pre-op length. Hakky wouldn't upsize LGX and AX for that particular reason. You just spreading misinformation trying to discourage people from going that route for the reasons that is hard to understand.
Boston Scientific says that LGX elongates right on its website, all the studies that you yourself cite point to elongation, no LGX recipient would back you up, and even doctors that don't implant it don't claim that it doesn't grow lengthwise, including Clavell. There are other reasons why some implanters like Eid and Clavell shy away from LGX: rigidity, propensity to bend during elongation but nobody claims that it can't grow lengthwise. That's why even the most aggressive implanters never upsize LGX, while routinely upsizing CX and Titan.
Good luck finding a single LGX recipient whose dick didn't become longer! Took me a while.
65 yrs old.
ED since about 2000.
Just moved to Trimix from Edex few months ago.
Implant doctor shopping now but doing BPH first.
ED since about 2000.
Just moved to Trimix from Edex few months ago.
Implant doctor shopping now but doing BPH first.
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Rider1400
- Posts: 1478
- Joined: Sun Dec 06, 2020 4:23 pm
- Location: Benton Arkansas
Re: Length question
LetoMan wrote:Rider1400 wrote:First off.. Letoman, I’ve watched many videos by Clavell, Perito and Eid and they all say that even the old school Coloplast titan will stretch out a small amount over time and there are AMS products that grow by design so cycling can in fact extend an implants length while growing to fit your corporal body.
Rider, that is simply not true: there are no videos of those guys saying that IPPs expand lengthwise. However, there are plenty of videos of them saying they expand in girth, so you may have confused the two.
For example, here is Clavell stating that IPPs “definitely does not improve” length, though they may increase girth. https://youtu.be/I4_X58B5qYA?is=MpsjdD55r9EyxYPX. The first two minutes cover this, the quote is at 1:30.
That is consistent with all of the studies on the matter, which consistently show that after a period of up to two years, IPPs, including the LGX, do not increase erect length beyond the measurement that was obtained with an intercavenous injection prior to implantation. For example, consider this study of LGX implantees that found “no statistical difference was seen between the baseline ICI-induced penile length and measurements at the end of follow-up.”
https://irp-cdn.multiscreensite.com/d88 ... action.pdf
A few days ago a user on this site showed mathematically why the force exerted on an implant expands it girthwise but not lenthwise. I’ll admit I can’t follow the math! But it is very interesting: viewtopic.php?t=28784
Look, I’m always open to considering other evidence. But I’ve been through this with a couple of other guys before on this website, and nobody has yet been able to produce these supposed videos of docs saying the implant will make your dick longer, nor any scientific evidence that they do. We owe it to the brothers that come here to give them accurate information. And it is simply inaccurate to say that implants make dicks longer, other than those small increases that happen when a revision is able to accommodate a larger size implant.
“Meet the penis episode 57”. Paul Perito states that the titan is made from a poloymere. It will stretch in length and girth. This is the reason he has the Perito exercises to help maximize this stretch. However you are limited by your cavernosa. It has limits and if you were perhaps maxed in length and it were to stretch any you. Old have an issue with erosion. I never said it can grow your penis! And totally think that you can’t grow it past its natural length. You can however fill the space available in the cavernosa.
Born 1965 ED at 45 pills,shots all failed.
Implanted 5-22 Titan 20cm with 1cm RTE.
Revision 3-26 Titan 24cm with 1cm trimmed off.
Infection, salvage 5-26 Titan 24cm -1cm trimmed
Explanted 6-17
Implanted 9-2 Titan 22cm less 1 cm trimmed
Implanted 5-22 Titan 20cm with 1cm RTE.
Revision 3-26 Titan 24cm with 1cm trimmed off.
Infection, salvage 5-26 Titan 24cm -1cm trimmed
Explanted 6-17
Implanted 9-2 Titan 22cm less 1 cm trimmed
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whatevery
- Posts: 165
- Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2025 3:10 pm
Re: Length question
Rider1400 wrote:
“Meet the penis episode 57”. Paul Perito states that the titan is made from a poloymere. It will stretch in length and girth. This is the reason he has the Perito exercises to help maximize this stretch. However you are limited by your cavernosa. It has limits and if you were perhaps maxed in length and it were to stretch any you. Old have an issue with erosion. I never said it can grow your penis! And totally think that you can’t grow it past its natural length. You can however fill the space available in the cavernosa.
How about expanding to your original penile length before it started to atrophy? Maximum stretch that I see on my VED dial is much longer than what I get via stretch test. That means that your dick is fully capable of stretching as far as VED takes it. I suspect that was my length in my younger days
Now, could LGX stretch it up to this VED dial length. I suspect the answer is yes. Titan and CX and we always forget about X probably not. AX? I'm yet to come across anyone who was able to take it beyond his pre-op length.
Still, I heard more than once of Titan gaining some small bit of length over pre-op length. I don't think I ever read of CX doing that.
65 yrs old.
ED since about 2000.
Just moved to Trimix from Edex few months ago.
Implant doctor shopping now but doing BPH first.
ED since about 2000.
Just moved to Trimix from Edex few months ago.
Implant doctor shopping now but doing BPH first.
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