Testosterone question

[hoosierphilly]

Make sure you do not have an underactive thyrid. Many have undiagnosed conditions. Tired and depressed are symptoms. You may test ok and still have it.
MD's don't pick up on this easily. Be sure you get your Sunshine vitamin and in the north do vitD. Try using full spectrum lights especially at your desks.
Some people have SAD.

[alibaba]

Thyroid is a good call. Mine docs always said it was within normal range. Was always tired. Seems normal is different for everyone. New doc said he thought we should try boosting the throxin a little bit. Lowest dose of 25mg. made all the difference in the world. Did the T3 and T4 test. I think T4 is the normal test they use, T3 is like the free testosterone and t4 is like total testosterone if that helps. T3 tells you how much USABLE thyroid hormone you have. Turns out my usable jumped up REAL nice with the little boost as my body metabalises t4 to turn it into T3 it extremely well. My wife on the other hand got no boost out of the thyroxin for years no matter how much they raised the dose. Her body doesn't do didly with the thyroxin ( T4) so the new doc put her on the T3, the form your body actually uses and it helped a LOT. Everyone is different. I always say if something does not work the way you expect, think outside the box. The view is ALWAYS better outside the box. As to the gel, I used 4 pumps a day of the Androgel for over a year. Damn stuff is expensive. helped but did nothing for libido. Changed to injectable 6 weeks ago. Going to write myself a script for lab work next week but i swear this cypionate works so well that I am certain the test will show I can reduce the dose. Everyone process' differently and at different speeds. if i did not split the dose of Androgel to twice a day, I would be sweating hot flashes by 8 p.m.because my body processed it so fast. Hope this gives you something helpful. Good luck

[hoosierphilly]

March 16, 2015

Studies Suggest Testosterone Therapy Poses No CV Risk in Men
Studies Suggest Testosterone Therapy Poses No CV Risk in Men
Data from a meta-analysis and an observational study suggest testosterone therapy is not associated with cardiovascular (CV) events in men, challenging earlier research that spurred the FDA to examine the safety of the treatment.

The two studies were presented at the American College of Cardiology (ACC) Scientific Sessions 2015 in San Diego.

Pawan Patel, MD, of Regions Hospital in St. Paul, Minnesota, and colleagues conducted the meta-analysis to better understand whether testosterone therapy puts men at greater risk for CV events. The analysis involved 29 heterogeneous studies featuring 122,889 men. Recent studies indicating an association between testosterone therapy and adverse CV events were included.

Dr. Patel and colleagues found that testosterone therapy did not significantly increase the risk for CV events in men (RR=1.168; CI, 0.794-1.718; P=.431).

“With an aging population and more and more men needing testosterone therapy, it is important to better understand its potential effect on cardiovascular health,” Dr. Patel said in a press release. “Our analysis ... gives hope that we can do more with testosterone therapy.”

Arshad Jahangir, MD, Zuber Ali, MD, and colleagues from Aurora Health Care in Wisconsin, found similar results in a study involving their community-based health care system.

The observational analysis included 7,245 men (mean age, 54 years) who had low testosterone levels (<300 ng/dL) between 2007 and 2013.

At 3-year follow-up, the CV event rate — a composite of acute myocardial infarction, stroke and death — was 5.5% in the treated arm and 6.7% in the untreated arm. After adjustment for age, prior myocardial infarction or stroke, cholesterol levels, smoking status and follow-up length, there was no difference in CV event rates between groups.

“The reassurance we get from this analysis in the community setting is that testosterone replacement therapy in patients with low serum levels is not causing any harm, even if it is not providing much cardiovascular benefit [in this patient population],” Dr. Jahangir said in the release.

“In the absence of prospective data, I think studies like ours will help ease anxieties around this treatment and provide some information on which physicians can base their prescribing decisions.”

Because of these results, Dr. Jahangir said that it is critical for physicians to continue to aggressively manage established patients' CV disease risk factors, since testosterone therapy may not have an effect. He also said an analysis to determine the role of testosterone therapy on metabolic parameters and bone fractures is currently ongoing.

References
1.Patel P et al. Abstract 1195-376.
2.Zuber A et al. Abstract 1126M-13. Both presented at: American College of Cardiology (ACC) 64th Annual Scientific Session & Expo; March 14-16, 2015; San Diego.



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[sliphill]

My testosterone got up to 800 on Androgel, but I did not feel any benefits whatsoever.

[dg_moore]

My testosterone got up to 800 on Androgel, but I did not feel any benefits whatsoever.

Likewise - I got mine up from 135(!) to 434 on Androgel, but also felt no benefits. It is very expensive, so in view of no benefit I discontinued it. I'm sure my T is back down, but I don't feel any different. I'll see what my uro has to say on the next visit, but I doubt if I'll resume the therapy.

[dtwarren1942]

I increased my T from 290 to over 800 after a year of TRT (Testim and Androgel). Improved libido significantly, but my dick remained limp. High libido and limp dick is a prescription for frustration. I quit TRT and my T fell to 190. It took six months before it returned to 300.

[tomas1]

I had the same result after starting the T injections. That made me try injecting. So far so good.

[Froggy]

I realize this is an old thread but just noticed it and it IS a subject of intense interest for me . . .

First I'd like to say that most GPs and Internists merely use the standard Bell curve to define "normal" T levels and go no further in identifying symptoms of low T beyond identifying via blood test if someone is normal. My personal experience with my internist mirrors this process and given my T level hovering around 400 he patted me on the head and said I was normal.

However, I just KNEW there was something not right with me . . . vanishing libido, lack of energy, fuzzy thinking, moody, etc. so I started educating myself by using authoritative sources such as Harvard and Johns Hopkins websites. I then went on the search for a Urologist, not just any Urologist but one specializing in Male Sexual Health. The results of my search was me finding Dr. Gary Price, Director of the Center for Human Sexuality at USMD/UANT Sexual Medicine center in Arlington, Tx. This folks was a LIFE CHANGING EXPERIENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My initial consult was eye opening . . . I had a recent blood test showing T level at about 390 which the lab showed as "normal", but, Dr. Price dug deep into my physical background, especially my cycling, power lifting and weight training and determined that "we" needed to get my T level up to 800-1000 and he immediately started me on Test injections of 1 ml/week of a 200 mg/ml solution.

Over just a 3 week period my wife noticed that my thoughts (as an engineer I tend to be very precise) were much sharper, my attitude was "bouncy" and in general I just seemed to be noticeably "better". At my 1 month followup for T level, estrogen and PSA levels even Dr. Price noticed a distinct improvement in my general alertness and engagement. At this time he added 5 mg every two weeks of anatrozole to lower estrogen levels while noting that my PSA level was completely normal and as expected.

About 4 month after starting the injections I underwent a total right knee replacement (July 2014) and started the recovery process. Note, on the day of surgery I weighed 263 pounds and wore size 40 pants. My therapist, surgeon and wife were all amazed by my much faster than normal recovery . . . in December I was walking 2 miles a day and during the 6 month surgery followup my Orthopedist stated that my strength and range of motion was FOUR MONTHS ahead of expected for a 61 year old man. By April 2105 my weight was down to 225, pants size to 34 and BF% down from over 30 to right around 19! He and I are convinced the improved T level is playing a major part in my speedy recovery.

So, to summarize an overlong post, the benefits, at least for me, of an APPROPRIATE T level have been incredible and go FAR beyond increased libido. Heck, the improvement in health, stamina and fitness are worth it all by themselves. Note, my libido improved but ED did not and WAS NOT EXPECTED TO merely due to improved T levels, but Trimix took care of THAT little issue

I am also lucky to have an incredibly supportive wife who is also a former medical assistant and she "loves" to stab me in the ass (alternate cheeks) once a week! LOL!

To make injection easier here is a trick she uses that may help with folks taking injections . . . Get two needles for each syringe, one to pierce the membrane on the top of the bottle then replace it with a new one for the injection itself since piercing the bottle does in fact somewhat dull the needle.

So:

1. Find a Uro who SPECIALIZES in Male Sexual health and work with them to determine your true "needed" T level, thow the "normal" chart out the window!
2. Avoid T Clinics . . . total ripoff!
3. Understand that the benefits of an appropriate T level go FAR beyond libido improvement. Don't forget, improved health all by itself is a GREAT libido enhancer!!!

OBTW as far as cost goes . . . a 10 ml bottle of T costs me $14 at CVS.

Hope this helps a bit

[tomas1]

Nice informative post. I wonder if your price is a copay? Sounds awfully low to me.
I've found that when injecting, if I give it a quick initial jab, it's lots less painful and once it's in, the pain is done and I can then insert the needle all way in.
I got up nerve to inject in the thighs, but I think there may be more nerves there and I can feel it for several days after injecting.
From now on, I'm an "ass man".
Have you noticed any shrinking of the testicles? I have.

[Froggy]

A friend of mine pays about $100 for a 10 ml bottle of 200mg/ml. For the potential benefit I consider this "dirt cheap". Good luck!

froggy